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2 Gurus Talk Compliance

2 Gurus Talk Compliance: Episode 78 – A Brave New World Edition

What happens when two top compliance commentators get together? They talk compliance, of course. Join Tom Fox and Kristy Grant-Hart in 2 Gurus Talk Compliance as they discuss the latest compliance issues in this week’s episode!

 Stories This Week Include:

  • SBF Applies for Pardon
  • Post Wells Issues for Profit Disgorgement
  • Sad Day for College Sports
  • Hungary uses AI to track Orban’s corruption
  • Meetings are Useless
  • Big Banks and New Tokenization
  • OFAC fines FTI
  • What is MNPI
  • The compliance job market
  • A Florida man writes on the whiteboard outside the house that he is not home. Arrested nonetheless

Resources:

Kristy

Kristy Grant-Hart on LinkedIn

Order Kristy’s updated, 10-year new edition of How to Be a Wildly Effective Compliance Officer by clicking here.

Tom

Check out the top compliance handbook, The Compliance Handbook, 7th edition, published by LexisNexis. Visit the LexisNexis® Store at https://lexisnexis.com/fox20

To save 20% on The Compliance Handbook: A Guide to Operationalizing Your Compliance Program, please reference or enter promotion code: FOX20.

Offer expires December 31, 2026. Offer applies to new orders only, before shipping and taxes are calculated and shipped to a U.S. address. A discount will be applied to each applicable product after the code FOX20 is entered. Discount does not apply to current subscriptions, renewals, or updates. Certain exclusions and other restrictions may apply. Void where prohibited. View full terms here.

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The CCO as AI Trust Architect

The most important AI risk inside many companies may not be that employees are using AI. It may be that employees are using AI and hiding what they are learning. That is the central compliance lesson from Eric Anicich and Jeslyn Brouwers’ HBR article, Why Employees Aren’t Transparent About Their AI Usage. The authors open with a physician who had built a highly effective prompting template inside an approved, HIPAA-compliant AI tool. His colleagues were struggling with the same tool. He believed his template could help them. Yet he did not share it.

The article reports that a study by KPMG and the University of Melbourne, involving more than 48,000 respondents, found that 57% of employees admitted to hiding their AI use at work. More importantly, the authors argue that concealed use is only part of the issue. What employees are learning privately through prompt sequences, chained tools, and successful workflows may matter even more. AI introduces what the authors call the suppression of solutions: employees may be withholding productivity breakthroughs that could help the entire organization.

For the CCO, this creates a new mandate. The compliance function must help bring AI use into the open without becoming the AI police. The CCO must build a governance system that encourages employees to disclose, share, and improve AI-enabled work while still protecting the company from real risks around confidentiality, privacy, IP, bias, inaccurate outputs, cybersecurity, records retention, regulatory representations, and misuse. That is the function the CCO can fulfill: the AI trust function.

Why Hidden AI Use Is a Compliance Problem

Most compliance professionals instinctively focus on the obvious AI risks. Employees may paste confidential data into public tools. They may use AI to draft customer-facing claims without verification. They may generate code, contracts, marketing copy, investigation summaries, due diligence reports, or regulatory submissions without appropriate review. They may rely on AI outputs that are inaccurate, biased, incomplete, or unsupported. Those risks are real.

But the authors point to a second problem: the company may also be losing the benefits of compliant AI experimentation. Productivity gains are once scaled through shared systems and standardized processes. With AI, many gains begin as individual discoveries: a better prompt, a workflow shortcut, a way to summarize information, a way to identify anomalies, or a method that reduces a multi-hour task to minutes. That knowledge is portable, private, and easy to conceal.

This means the CCO must avoid a one-dimensional response. A punitive AI governance program may reduce some visible misuse, but it may also drive experimentation underground. Employees who fear being judged, punished, overworked, or replaced will not share what they are doing. They will protect themselves. That creates the worst of both worlds: risk remains hidden, and useful innovation remains trapped inside individual workflows.

The CCO’s New Role: Govern for Trust, Not Just Control

The author’s core finding is highly relevant to compliance. They surveyed 604 U.S.-based employees who used AI at work daily or multiple times per day. Nearly one in three said they had intentionally withheld AI-related knowledge, workflows, or techniques. Employees in the lowest quartile of organizational trust were nearly four times as likely to withhold AI knowledge as those in the highest quartile (47% versus 14%). A similar pattern appeared for psychological safety, 45% versus 17%.

That finding should feel familiar to compliance professionals. Speak-up culture works the same way. Employees report misconduct when they believe the company will listen, protect them, and act fairly. Employees hide misconduct when they believe the company will punish the messenger, ignore the issue, or retaliate indirectly. AI transparency is now a speak-up issue.

The CCO should therefore treat AI disclosure as part of the company’s broader culture of integrity. The question is not merely, “Are employees using approved AI tools? ”The better question is, ‘Do employees trust us enough to tell us how they are using AI, what they have learned, where they are uncertain, and what risks they see? ”

That is where the compliance function can add unique value. Compliance already understands reporting channels, non-retaliation, policy clarity, training, investigation triage, escalation, monitoring, remediation, third-party risk, and board reporting. Those capabilities can be applied to AI governance if the CCO frames the issue correctly.

Distinguish Experimentation from Misconduct

A major insight in the article is that companies often confuse two very different categories of behavior. One is blameworthy deviance: ignoring rules or cutting corners in ways that harm the organization. The other is exploratory testing: experimenting at the edge of what is known in ways that can generate valuable learning. When companies confuse the second with the first, they punish the behavior they need to encourage. This is directly applicable to the CCO.

An employee who uploads customer personal data into an unapproved public AI tool may have created a serious compliance issue. An employee who uses an approved internal AI tool to create a better first draft of a due diligence memo may have created a learning opportunity. An employee who uses AI to fabricate supporting documentation has engaged in misconduct. An employee who uses AI to test a workflow and then asks compliance whether the use is permissible has done exactly what the company should want. The CCO’s job is to build a framework that makes those distinctions clear.

That means creating red lines, green lanes, and gray zones. Red lines are prohibited uses: confidential data in unapproved tools, AI-generated false records, unreviewed regulatory filings, discriminatory automated decision-making, or any use that circumvents required approvals. Green lanes are encouraged for use: approved tools for summarization, first drafts, brainstorming, translation support, policy search, training development, or internal productivity tasks, where appropriate safeguards are in place. Gray zones are uses that require consultation: HR decisions, customer communications, legal analysis, investigation outputs, high-risk third-party reviews, or regulated submissions.

A compliance program that treats every use of AI as suspicious will teach employees to hide. A compliance program that treats every use of AI as harmless will fail in its duty. The CCO must create the middle path: clear, risk-based, practical, and trusted.

Earn the Disclosure You Want

The article advises leaders to “earn the disclosure” they want. Employees need clear guidance on what AI use is encouraged, what is off-limits, and how to handle gray areas. The authors also warn that companies should not force employees to convert a useful prompt into a long process memo. Lightweight templates, short demos, and practical “show me how you built this” sessions are better ways to turn private methods into reusable knowledge.

That is a practical blueprint for the CCO. A CCO should create an AI disclosure process that is easy to use. It should not feel like an investigation request. It should not require a ten-page form. It should not punish employees for asking questions. The goal is to make disclosure normal.

That is enough to begin. The CCO can then partner with IT, Legal, Privacy, Cybersecurity, HR, Internal Audit, and business leaders to determine whether the workflow should be approved, modified, shared, restricted, or escalated. The key is tone. The message should be: “Show us what you are learning so we can help you use AI safely and scale what works.”

Reward Multiplier Behavior

The article warns against rewarding only individual AI productivity. If employees believe that sharing makes them less distinctive while others benefit, they will hide. Instead, companies should reward reusable workflows, peer adoption, quality improvements, and contributions that help others. The authors recommend giving credit in performance reviews, protecting time for continued experimentation, and closing the loop by telling employees where their contribution was used and what improved. This is where a CCO can help turn AI transparency into culture.

Compliance should not run a generic AI leaderboard that encourages unhealthy competition. Instead, the CCO should help build recognition for responsible AI multipliers: employees who find a better way to do their work, disclose it, help validate it, and enable the company to scale it safely. This turns AI governance from a prohibition system into an integrity system. Employees are not just being told what not to do. They are being recognized for helping the company do better.

In compliance terms, that means rewarding employees who:

  • Identify a safe AI workflow that improves the effectiveness of control.
  • Flag a risky AI use before harm occurs.
  • Develop a prompt that improves due diligence quality.
  • Create a monitoring workflow that identifies anomalies faster.
  • Help colleagues use approved tools properly.
  • Document limitations and human review requirements.
  • Share lessons learned from AI experimentation.

Treat Disclosure as a Contribution

One of the article’s most powerful points is that the manager’s reaction in the first thirty seconds after an employee discloses an AI workflow may be the decisive trust signal. If the employee is treated as though they cut corners, they learn to hide. If the disclosure is treated as something worth understanding, they learn that disclosure pays. The authors also warn that disclosure should not amount to unpaid labor; the employee should demonstrate the method once, and the company should then own the documentation, distribution, and support, while the discoverer keeps the credit. This is a direct instruction to compliance professionals.

A CCO should train managers to respond the same way. Most AI disclosures will not go to compliance first. They will happen in team meetings, performance conversations, project reviews, and manager check-ins. If local managers shame employees for using AI, employees will hide. If local managers automatically add more work to anyone who discloses a productivity gain, employees will hide. If local managers give credit and bring compliance in as a partner, employees will share.

The CCO’s AI Trust Playbook

A CCO who wants to fulfill this function should take five practical steps.

  1. Create a risk-based AI use framework. Define prohibited uses, encouraged uses, and uses requiring consultation. Make the guidance short, practical, and example-driven.
  2. Build a safe AI disclosure channel. This should be separate from the hotline in tone, even if connected administratively. Employees need a place to ask, “Can I use AI this way? ”without feeling as if they are self-reporting misconduct.
  3. Launch structured AI learning sessions. Invite employees to demonstrate useful workflows created with approved tools. Keep documentation light. Capture the use case, data inputs, review controls, risks, and adoption potential.
  4. Partner with HR on incentives. Ensure responsible AI sharing is recognized in performance reviews, promotion discussions, and leadership communications. Reward employees who become AI multipliers, not only those who quietly produce more.
  5. Report AI transparency metrics to leadership and the board. Do not only report policy completion or tool adoption. Report the number of disclosed workflows, number approved for broader use, number modified for risk reasons, number rejected, key risk themes, training gaps, and examples where disclosure improved both productivity and control.

Conclusion

The CCO should not try to own every aspect of AI. IT must own infrastructure. Cybersecurity must own security controls. Legal must advise on legal risks.  Privacy must address data protection. HR must address workforce impacts. Business leaders must own operational use cases. Internal audit must test the program. But the CCO can own the trust architecture.

The bottom line is straightforward. AI governance cannot be built only on restriction, monitoring, and fear. That approach may make the company look controlled while driving the most important AI activity underground.

The CCO has a different opportunity: to build an AI trust function that brings use cases, risks, questions, and innovations into the open. The compliance function should not be the department that says, “Do not use AI.” It should be the function that says, “Use it responsibly, show us what you are learning, and let us help the company scale it safely.” That is how compliance fulfills this function. It turns hidden AI use into visible learning, visible learning into governed practice, and governed practice into ethical business value.

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AI Today in 5

AI Today in 5: June 11, 2026, The OpenAI & Compliance Edition

Welcome to AI Today in 5, the newest addition to the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, Tom Fox will bring you 5 stories about AI to start your day. Sit back, enjoy a cup of morning coffee, and listen in to AI Today In 5. All, from the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, we consider five stories from the business world, compliance, ethics, risk management, leadership, or general interest about AI.

Top AI stories include:

  1. Luxembourg and trusted financial data. (FinTechGlobal)
  2. AI governance grows at an uneven pace. (PlanAdviser)
  3. AI and spend management. (FinTechMagazine)
  4. The next changes in banking will not be in tech. (The Financial Brand)
  5. OpenAI funds start up for compliance. (Bloomberg)

For more information on the use of AI in compliance programs, Tom Fox’s new book, Upping Your Game, is available. You can purchase a copy of the book on ⁠Amazon.com⁠.

To learn about the intersection of Sherlock Holmes and the modern compliance professional, check out Tom’s latest book, The Game is Afoot-What Sherlock Holmes Teaches About Risk, Ethics and Investigations on ⁠Amazon.com⁠.

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AI Today in 5

AI Today in 5: June 10, 2026, The End of Legacy Compliance Edition

Welcome to AI Today in 5, the newest addition to the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, Tom Fox will bring you 5 stories about AI to start your day. Sit back, enjoy a cup of morning coffee, and listen in to AI Today In 5. All, from the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, we consider five stories from the business world, compliance, ethics, risk management, leadership, or general interest about AI.

Top AI stories include:

  1. AI and the end of legacy compliance. (FinTechGlobal)
  2. The Great American AI Act. (ClearanceJobs)
  3. AI and cybersecurity risks in healthcare. (Forbes)
  4. Will AI improve the banking experience? (The Conversation)
  5. Will AI help women in financial services? (FinTechMagazine)

For more information on the use of AI in compliance programs, Tom Fox’s new book, Upping Your Game, is available. You can purchase a copy of the book on ⁠Amazon.com⁠.

To learn about the intersection of Sherlock Holmes and the modern compliance professional, check out Tom’s latest book, The Game is Afoot-What Sherlock Holmes Teaches About Risk, Ethics and Investigations on ⁠Amazon.com⁠.

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AI Today in 5

AI Today in 5: June 9, 2026, The OpenAI Files to go Public Edition

Welcome to AI Today in 5, the newest addition to the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, Tom Fox will bring you 5 stories about AI to start your day. Sit back, enjoy a cup of morning coffee, and listen in to AI Today In 5. All, from the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, we consider five stories from the business world, compliance, ethics, risk management, leadership, or general interest about AI.

Top AI stories include:

  1. AI-ready compliance for reg tech. (FinTechGlobal)
  2. AI agents under antitrust scrutiny. (NYT)
  3. Procurement and AI governance. (Observer.com)
  4. Is your bank ready for Agentic AI? (OpenTextBlog)
  5. Transparency is key for AI use in healthcare. (Ohio.Edu)

For more information on the use of AI in compliance programs, Tom Fox’s new book, Upping Your Game, is available. You can purchase a copy of the book on ⁠Amazon.com⁠.

To learn about the intersection of Sherlock Holmes and the modern compliance professional, check out Tom’s latest book, The Game is Afoot-What Sherlock Holmes Teaches About Risk, Ethics and Investigations on ⁠Amazon.com⁠.

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Innovation in Compliance

Innovation in Compliance: Rethinking SpeakUp: UX, Trust, and AI in Whistleblowing and Investigations with Tim Morss

Innovation comes in many areas, and compliance professionals need to not only be ready for it but also embrace it. Join Tom Fox, the Voice of Compliance, as he visits with top innovative minds, thinkers, and creators in the award-winning Innovation in Compliance podcast. In this episode,  host Tom visits with Tim Morss, CEO at SpeakUp, about the evolution of speak-up systems from the employee perspective.

Morss describes his background in compliance technology and SpeakUp’s global footprint, emphasizing that employee expectations favor frictionless, mobile-first, intuitive reporting with transparency and feedback over 800-number hotlines and complex forms. He notes common program gaps: hard-to-find reporting channels, poor mobile experiences, overreliance on telephony (especially problematic for non-English speakers), insufficient guidance on what to report, and weak trust due to lack of follow-up and perceived inaction. They consider generational preferences, privacy-aware deployment, such as QR code placement, and AI use cases such as multilingual voice intake for illiterate supply-chain workers, while cautioning against unsafe AI practices and autonomous decision-making. Morss highlights investigative management as a major opportunity beyond basic case repositories and forecasts greater AI-driven integration with in-house systems amid geopolitical and regulatory divergence.

Key highlights:

  • Employee Expectations Shift
  • Common SpeakUp Mistakes
  • Trust and Anti-Retaliation
  • Gen Z Reporting Channels
  • AI Voice for Workers
  • One Practical CCO Tip

Resources:

Connect with Tim Morss on LinkedIn

SpeakUp

Innovation in Compliance was recently honored as the Number 4 podcast in Risk Management by 1,000,000 Podcasts

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AI Today in 5

AI Today in 5: June 8, 2026, The 4 Harsh Realities Edition

Welcome to AI Today in 5, the newest addition to the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, Tom Fox will bring you 5 stories about AI to start your day. Sit back, enjoy a cup of morning coffee, and listen in to AI Today In 5. All, from the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, we consider five stories from the business world, compliance, ethics, risk management, leadership, or general interest about AI.

Top AI stories include:

  1. A single AML regime for the EU. ⁠(FinTech Global)⁠
  2. AI agents under anti-trust scrutiny. (⁠Hogan Lovells)⁠
  3. Compliance hiring: AI governance skills needed. (⁠Law.Com⁠)
  4. AI gets 76% of healthcare inquiries correct. (⁠PennState Health)⁠
  5. 4 harsh realities of the AI business. (Axios⁠)⁠

For more information on the use of AI in compliance programs, Tom Fox’s new book, Upping Your Game, is available. You can purchase a copy of the book on ⁠Amazon.com⁠.

To learn about the intersection of Sherlock Holmes and the modern compliance professional, check out Tom’s latest book, The Game is Afoot-What Sherlock Holmes Teaches About Risk, Ethics and Investigations on ⁠Amazon.com⁠.

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AI Today in 5

AI Today in 5: June 5, 2026, The Tech Review, Not Political Review Edition

Welcome to AI Today in 5, the newest addition to the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, Tom Fox will bring you 5 stories about AI to start your day. Sit back, enjoy a cup of morning coffee, and listen in to the AI Today In 5. All, from the Compliance Podcast Network. Each day, we consider five stories from the business world, compliance, ethics, risk management, leadership, or general interest about AI.

Top AI stories include:

  1. Smaller banks are missing out on financial crime prevention tools. (FinTechGlobal)
  2. Source of training data for central AI risk. (The National Law Review)
  3. GEICO pays a fine for AI-based policy cancellation due to insufficient notice. (ClarkHill)
  4. Managing AI regulatory complexity. (KPMG)
  5. OpenAI wants a tech review, not political considerations from the Administration. (CSO Online)

For more information on the use of AI in compliance programs, Tom Fox’s new book, Upping Your Game, is available. You can purchase a copy of the book on Amazon.com.

To learn about the intersection of Sherlock Holmes and the modern compliance professional, check out Tom’s latest book, The Game is Afoot-What Sherlock Holmes Teaches About Risk, Ethics and Investigations on Amazon.com.

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AI in Healthcare

AI in Healthcare: Five Healthcare AI Stories You Need to Know This Week – June 5, 2026

Welcome to AI in Healthcare in 5 Stories. This podcast is a Weekly Briefing of the five most important AI developments shaping healthcare, medicine, and life sciences. Each week, Tom Fox breaks down the latest stories on clinical innovation, regulation, privacy, compliance, patient safety, and operational transformation through a practical, business-focused lens. Designed for healthcare compliance professionals, executives, legal teams, clinicians, and industry leaders, the podcast moves beyond headlines to explain what each development means in the real world.

The top five stories for the week ending June 5, 2026, include:

  1. Mayo Clinic partners with Microsoft for AI in healthcare. (Microsoft)
  2. AI certification in healthcare. (Fierce Healthcare)
  3. Colorado enacts AI guardrails for healthcare. (CoHouseDems)
  4. Putting people at the center of AI in healthcare. (BDO USA)
  5. 6 top worries for AI in healthcare. (HealthExec)

For more information on the use of AI in Compliance programs, Tom Fox’s new book, Upping Your Game, is available. You can purchase a copy of the book on Amazon.com.

To learn about the intersection of Sherlock Holmes and the modern compliance professional, check out Tom’s latest book, The Game is Afoot-What Sherlock Holmes Teaches About Risk, Ethics and Investigations on Amazon.com.

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AI in Financial Services in 5 Stories

AI in Financial Services in 5 Stories – Week Ending June 5, 2026

Welcome to AI in Financial Services in 5 Stories. A practical weekly roundup of the five most important AI developments affecting banking, insurance, payments, asset management, and fintech. Each Friday, Tom Fox will break down the top stories that matter most through the lenses of compliance, risk management, governance, and business strategy. Designed for compliance professionals, executives, legal teams, and financial services leaders, it goes beyond headlines to explain why each development matters in a highly regulated industry. The result is a concise weekly briefing that helps listeners stay current on AI innovation while asking sharper questions about oversight, accountability, and trust.

This week’s stories include:

  1. Smaller banks are missing out on financial crime prevention tools. (FinTech Global)
  2. Top AI and Fintech firms for 2026. (Forbes)
  3. Goldman CEO on running a bank in the age of AI. (Bloomberg)
  4. AI is breaking the old banking hiring model. (techcabal)
  5. AI cyber risk is the highest risk in banking. (FT)

For more information on the use of AI in Compliance programs, Tom Fox’s new book, Upping Your Game, is available. You can purchase a copy of the book on Amazon.com.

To learn about the intersection of Sherlock Holmes and the modern compliance professional, check out Tom’s latest book, The Game is Afoot-What Sherlock Holmes Teaches About Risk, Ethics and Investigations on Amazon.com.